XX-XY Athletics Founder, Jennifer Sey on Cancellation, Courage and Making it Cool to Defend Women's Sports
Even through the computer screen, Jennifer Sey projects the ease of someone at home in the world and her own skin. Sey is the founder of and CEO of XX-XY Athletics, an apparel company that bills itself at the only brand that stands up for women’s sports. She is also someone used to saying what she thinks—and that has some people running scared.
We are here to talk about Title IX and how XX-XY was banned from TikTok for running an advertisement standing up for women’s sports. (shortly after this conversation the company was subject to more digital censorship—see Jennifer’s video about it here).
Nancy McDermott: Before we get into talking about the ad, can you explain, just for people who may not be familiar with your story, who you are and how you got here?
Jennifer Sey: Well, I'll give you the highlights of me and who I am. I was an internationally competitive athlete as a child. I was a gymnast and I started just two years after Title IX passed. So, I certainly was a beneficiary of Title IX and the guarantee of girls’ and women's sex-based rights. I was a national team member for seven years and was the 1986 national champion.
Gymnastics is pretty brutal. Later in life when I was around 40, nearly 20 years later, I became very outspoken about the abuses in the sport, the emotional, physical, and even sexual abuse. I was the first person to speak out about it in 2008 in a book I wrote called “Chocked Up.” And while that doesn't seem very controversial now, it was very controversial at the time. It's pre-Me-Too era. You weren't supposed to say these things. So, that was my sort of first run at being canceled. But I got through it and, of course, was proven right in the end. So, that's my sports background.
I am also a corporate executive. I have worked for, gosh, over 30 years—showing my age—in the fashion industry, first at an advertising agency, then GAP, and then at Levi’s for 23 years. I'm really proud of my time at Levi’s and the work that I did. I still think it's an amazing brand.
NM: What made you leave?
JS: In 2020, I was outspoken about the need to open public schools during COVID. That was a very controversial position to take, and I was essentially run out of town. I ended up leaving San Francisco because of the harassment in my own city and because I wanted my own children to be able to go to school. I ultimately decided to resign from Levi's in 2022 and then kind of had to figure out what I was going to do next.
After interviewing at a few large companies and basically being told I would need to apologize for the things I had said during COVID and for having taken the stand that I did, I decided that I was not going to do that. That led me down a new path where I felt like I was going to have to start my own thing if I was going to continue to do the work that I like to do.
So, I had an idea to start an athletic apparel brand that stands up for women's sports and spaces. It really combined my background as a high-level athlete, fashion executive, and person who says things that get her into trouble. So that resulted in XX-XY Athletics, which just launched on March 25th.
NM: And then you were canceled again! TikTok canceled the ad! I was kind of flabbergasted when I heard this because I had watched the ad. It was gorgeous, and the importance of sports for girls and women really came through. It was just so patently true, it’s hard to see how anyone but the hardest-bitten activist would find it offensive. Have they shared with you what the complaint was?
JS: Well, they say if you've been canceled twice, you are un-cancellable… but the answer to your question is “no”. They haven’t shared anything about the complaint.
To explain what happened: we made a 60-second ad, which I actually wrote the words for, and my creative director did all the visuals. We worked on it together. We had a different ad we were going to launch with, but we didn't love it and we wanted something that was really moving and I... Oh, it just sort of came out of my brain because it's how I feel. I think it's really uplifting and touching, and it's a call to women and girls to stand up for yourselves and to stand together, and that it isn't bigoted to do so, no matter what names they call you.
So, it's ironic that, at the end of the day, we're being told that what we said was offensive and we can no longer advertise on TikTok.
To be fair, we haven't really been on TikTok. We were focusing our efforts elsewhere, but we decided to do a little test. We put a bit of money behind the ad, paid it, and just a few days later we got a notification that we were permanently suspended and that the content violated their advertising policies because it was offensive!
There was no explanation as to what policy was violated or what was offensive about it. So it seems to me that actually standing up for women and girls is considered offensive today somehow, which seems crazy.
NM: I really liked that you had the different generations of girls because I have been thinking about our generation. I’m a few years older than you, but we're from the same era. I don't consciously remember Title IX, but I do remember that it felt like something was changing, like there was something in the air—even beyond sports. But maybe that’s where it started. It just felt like we were lucky and that everything was possible.
JS. I don't remember when it passed. I was three probably. But I do remember the 70s and feeling like there was nothing off-limits to me. I mean, there wasn’t as much because it took time to build the number of opportunities. There wasn't a soccer club on every corner for girls like there is now. There were only a limited number of sports. My chosen sport, gymnastics, took off in the 70s because of Nadia Comăneci. Everybody wanted to be like Nadia, and suddenly there were gyms everywhere. It made good sense for these gymnastics clubs to open. You know, young girls were enthralled with Nadia and the parents were into it because they knew it could lead to opportunities for their children further down the road.
So that was my sense. I mean, I played little league for a season, with the boys, actually, but I never felt like there was anything off-limits. So, I think that's the thing in the air.
NM: That sounds right. And it makes me worried about what will happen with the new Title IX. We sometimes take it for granted that things always move forward, but they can move backward too.
JS: Oh, for sure. And it feels like a giant step backward. I would say it was an illegal rewrite of Title IX. It was not legislated. It was just sort of smuggled in by the Department of Education. They make changes all the time about how funds are allocated, but they're changes to administrative things. They're not fundamental changes to the meaning of the law. And this law guaranteed girls’ and women's sex-based rights within the education system.
Title IX was not just about sports either. People don't realize how restricted education was. There were even certain subjects young women weren’t allowed to major in at college. Now those sex-based rights are being replaced with gender identity. So now when a male who identifies as a woman wants to, you know, join a sorority, enter women's spaces play on a women's sports team, that is what is protected. If anyone expresses discomfort with it, it will be considered harassment because if you say you're a woman, you're a woman — and there is no appeal! That is also part of this new Title IX. There's no due process written in. That means if you are accused of harassment, you can be kicked out of your university, lose your scholarship, or whatever the case may be. It's problematic on many, many levels because it just erases the original meaning of the legislation.
Just because you say you're a woman, that doesn't make you a woman. Fair treatment can be guaranteed some other way, not in Title IX and not by getting rid of sex-based rights. If women are just a type of man, then, it's almost like erasing the whole category.
The other thing that is so ironic is—and this was very much top of mind for me when I wrote the words in that ad—it's men, telling us to sit down and be quiet. The misogyny is staggering! If men were telling women to sit down and be quiet, in any other situation, the feminists would race to women's defense. But in this case, because the male says he is female, we are supposed to shut up and be quiet.
Well, I'm not. No. It took me plenty long to find my voice. I'm certainly not going to sit down now. It's ridiculous. It doesn't make any sense, and I think people are getting pretty fed up with it.
NM: What’s your sense of what people are thinking now the changes to Title IX are actually going through? I know a lot of people who complain privately but haven’t spoken publicly. I get that they are afraid, but now the rubber is hitting the road.
JS: It feels to me like something is changing. I mean, when we found out that our ad was being banned from TikTok, and that we were being banned permanently, the outpouring of support was amazing. People who came to our website just to buy products to show they supported us. I mean, we had our best day ever! I think people are beginning to weigh in, and they're saying, “No, I'm not going to participate in this lie." We're not going to stop. Call me whatever name you want, bully me as much as you want. We're not going to let the craziest people have the mic.”
NM: That's good to hear.
JS: I don't think it is anywhere near over, but I do think there is a rising wave of support because it's so ridiculous. It is such a fundamental truth that male and female bodies are different. There's no evidence that they are the same or that sex is not binary, but maybe people have thought they will sit this one out, just be quiet, and hope it will pass. Speaking up felt fringe. It doesn't feel that way anymore. I think the people who were waiting are ready to step up. Because 70% of Americans agree with us on this.
NM: How do you think XX-XY Athletics can help?
I'm not a politician. I'm not a legislator. I'm not a lawyer. I don't want to be any of those things. But I do know how to build a business and run a strong, emotionally resonant brand. Brands change the way people think about things. I mean, Dove really set the body positivity movement on fire before it jumped the shark and turned into something else. I think it did a lot of good. So, I just felt like if we can make high-quality products and beautiful marketing like this ad, we can sort of normalize it. Cool brands can make things cool. It could be cool to stand up and say, “ I'm for women and girls, that's a compassionate view”.
NM: Anything final thoughts?
JS: No, I mean, I think it's the whole thing is so meta, right? We did an ad telling people to stand up for themselves and don't back down because you're called a name. And then we were basically called a name, kicked off the platform and told we were too offensive to be there.
I think it illustrates the point of how challenging but important this battle is and how we really need everybody to screw up their courage, stand up and do the right thing. Because again, 70% of the adults agree with us. That includes a lot of Democrats.
Come on. Just take the step.
Follow Jennifer Sey on X
Join Genspect USA and special guests May Mailman, Director of the Independent Women’s Law Center, and Jennifer Sey, founder of the new apparel company XX-XY Athletics to discuss how the new Title IX could impact children and schools.
When Sey referred to women being told to be quiet, a certain David Tennant sprang to mind when he told Kemi Badenoch to shut up. The misogyny that's around at the minute is breathtaking and yet it's seen as progress. This nonsense has to stop as Woman's role in public life will become increasingly constrained. Women's sports will be won by men, women will feel unsafe in public facilities supposedly designated for their sole use, education, training schemes and shortlists for women and girls will be filled by men. The list goes on. I'm very worried for the future if nothing is done to stop this 'progress'.
Keep fighting. I too benefited from title 9, didn’t even know it at the time till I spoke with older women- like my mother and stepmothrer. Thank you for fighting this misogyny and nonsense!